Attar's Conference of the Birds, Part 4

Leyla: salām, Omid jān.

Omid: salām, Leyla jān.

Leyla: And salām bé hamegee. Welcome to part four of our discussion on Attar’s Conference of the Birds. So up until this point, we have heard the hodhod bird talk about the beginning of the journey, or why they need to go on the journey. And last time, we covered the Seven Valleys, which is very meaty. Like Omid said, each line can be a whole area of study of what these Seven Valleys are. But we're going to continue our journey, if you're looking at the guide, with line 29. And I think let's jump right into it.

Omid: Perfect, perfect. So after describing the Seven Valleys and what each of them entails, the hoopoe says this, she says, “vā nayāmad dar jahān z'een rāh kas neest az farsangé ān āgāh kas.” “farsang” is an old Persian unit of distance, of usually travel distance. Usually six kilometers or so. Though it has varied historically. But we usually translated “farsang” as a ‘league’, kind of. But either way, the hoopoe says, nobody has ever returned to the world from having gone on this journey, on this road. And so no one knows how many leagues it spans. No one knows really how long it actually is. And again, that's another clue as to what kind of journey this is. It's not a literal physical journey, it's a mystical journey. And the idea of no one returning from it, is the idea that anyone that goes on this journey and really completes it, becomes so transformed almost, that they're no longer themselves. Right? So it's not like you literally don't come back, but you come back so changed and so transformed that you're not really that same person that had gone originally, taken on the journey. And then, nobody knows how long or how far it is. There’s also another idea, clue to the idea, that we have to discover it for ourself. No one can really describe anything about this journey beyond what the hoopoe has said. The rest of it has to be undertaken and experienced directly by each one of us. So that's also the idea there. And then she says, oh, this is the end of the description. Right? And now we see how the birds respond. The last we heard of them, they were huddled together because they had seen a little, had gotten a glimpse of the beginning of this wilderness that they're about to go in to. And now, after the description, what happens? Attar says, “jomléyé morghān zé howl ō beemé rāh bāl ō par porkhoon, barāvardand āh.” ‘All the birds, out of their dread and terror of this path, they heaved the heavy sigh’, “barāvardand āh”. “āh” is like a ‘deep, heavy sigh’. And they heave the heavy sigh with bloodstained wings and feathers. So again, bloodstained here. A lot of times in Persian literature, bloodstained is not literal. Also, it's just kind of, a reference to the idea of something that fills you with fear or something that fills you with dread in a sense. It's like idiomatic. And so, the idea that comes together is that the birds are still in “howl ō beemé”. Another paired expression. “howl ō beem” is really ‘terror and fear’ or ‘dread and fear’. So they're still in apprehension and they're still anxious about the path, even after this description, or maybe even more so to the point where they "āh bar meeyāvarand." They are sighing very loudly and audibly from the sense of dread and anxiety. And so he continues and says, “rāh meedeedand pāyān nāpadeed dard meedeedand darmān nāpadeed.” Again, the word "nāpadeed," which we had before, something that is ‘invisible’, something that cannot be seen here. What cannot be seen is two things. One is “pāyāné rāh,” ‘the end of the road’. So as they’re looking at the journey, they do not see where it's going to end. And the second thing is they cannot see any end to the pain that they're going to experience on this road. “darmān,” which is kind of a ‘remedy’ and “dard,” which is ‘pain’. So “darmān nāpadeed” means they could not see how the pain of this journey would ever be remedied because it seems like an endless journey to them. And so this repetition of “nāpadeed” is really to show us again, Attar is showing us that both the pain or the difficulty of the journey and the length of the journey seems unending to the birds. And again, the idea of you're going into something that is unknown, something that is unfamiliar. It's very, very important to know that. And so you're taking it on really on faith. No one’s guaranteeing that it's going to end at a certain point in a certain way. And no one's guaranteeing that you're going to only have this much difficulty along the path. You just have to go and discover it for yourself. But the good thing is that they're not disappointed or anxious enough to not go. They don't give up on the idea of the journey because Attar tells us, “jomlé dast az jān beshosté pākbāz bāré eeshān bas gerān ō rah darāz” He says, ‘they have all washed their hands of life.’ Remember before we said “doshmané kheesh āmadand.” That same energy is still there. They’ve washed their hands of life, they've let go of everything, and they know that their “bār,” their ‘burden’ is “gerān”. “gerān” here, means ‘heavy,’ not expensive, but ‘heavy.’ So they have a “bāré gerān,” they have a heavy burden to undertake. And “rah darāz.” They understand that it is a very long journey. But they have washed their hands, “dast az shon neshostan,” ‘of their own life.’ In other words, they're ready to put everything on the line. And another word that describes this state is “pākbāz.” “pākbāz” literally means somebody who gambles everything fully and entirely. Someone who risks everything without holding anything back. And so, again, even though they are anxious and apprehensive and they're all huddled together, they're still ready and willing to go on the journey, presumably because that love and that passion and that yearning is still very, very strong. Stronger than their fear, stronger than their anxiety. So that's the idea. The apprehension and the worry about the dangers of the road is overcome, is less than their excitement to experience and to go forward and understand, to get this insight and find this king that they're looking for, ultimately. Oh, wonderful. So that's the good news. They're going to go on their journey. And so we fast forward to where Attar says, “sālhā raftand dar sheeb ō farāz sarf shod dar rāheshān omree darāz” For years they traveled through ups and downs and a whole lifetime, a long lifetime was spent, along this journey. “sheeb ō farāz,” another pair here. Literally ‘descent’ and ‘ascent,’ ‘descent’ and ‘ascent.’ Or just ups and downs, simply. It's to describe the road itself, the journey itself. So the path of truth, Attar is telling us, is really never a straight line and it's never a short one. We can spend a whole lifetime, “omree darāz,” ‘a long lifetime,’ seeking. It's never going to be a nice, smooth journey. There’s going to be lots and lots of ups and downs. And he says, “ānché eeshān-rā dar een rah rokh nemood key tavānad sharhé ān pāsokh nemood” ō “kee tavānad,” either way “tavānad sharhé ān pāsokh nemood.” He says, ‘what happened to them or what appeared to them on this journey, on this path, who or how long would it take to explain or recount it.’ In other words, it's unexplainable, it's unrecountable. Again, a reference to the idea that one has to go on this journey oneself to discover what it entails. And anyone who's going to tell you what it's like is never really going to fully be able to explain it to you. Attar tries by telling us about these valleys and just even creating this whole story of the journey to give us a sense of it, but here he very clearly says, this is not the journey itself. I’m describing something to you, but you will only understand it by going on the journey on your own, by yourself. And so he really explicitly says that in the next verse. He says, “gar tō ham roozee foroo āyee bé rāh aghabéyé ān rah konee yek yek negāh” And I’ll read the next verse too and then I’ll come back. “bāzdānee ānché eeshān kardé-and rowshanat gardad ké chon khoon khordé-and” These two verses really go together. In verse 35 he says, ‘if you, too, one day step onto this path and come face to face with each of the hardships of that journey, then’, “bāzdānee,” ‘then you will also understand what they have accomplished, what they have achieved. And it will become clear to you also how much they suffered along the way.’ So now he's explicitly saying, look, I can tell you as much as I can about this journey, but really only by you going on the journey yourself that you'll know what it's like, what it entails, how much difficulty it has along the way, but also what a great accomplishment, what a great achievement it is to actually go and fulfill this journey. And so it's really an invitation, I think ultimately, but also a little bit of a warning not to take anyone else's word because their journey, ultimately each of our journeys, is different and very, very personal, even if there are common steps and parts along the way as the Seven Valleys.

Leyla: So how does that relate to the hodhod? In the beginning, it’s the hodhod telling us about this journey. And has the hodhod already gone through the Seven Valleys, and then is coming back to relay the message, and then is asking all the other birds to come along as well?

Omid: That's a great question. That's a great question. I would say that when the hodhod says, I have not been able to find the King, I think that tells us that the hodhod also has heard about these valleys, but has not fully gone on the journey herself. I think that's what that statement implies. So again, it's just a reinforcement that knowing about it, hearing about it, even reading descriptions of it is one thing, but that's never the same as actually going on the journey. Right? And the other part is, even though we're encouraged to go on this journey, collectively or with companions, that still does not mean that we're all going to have the exact same experience. And this is our little abridged version, but if you go and read the entire book, you'll see that ultimately the birds do have different experiences along the way as well. And there's also a whole section that we don't have time to cover, which is that even before they decide to go on the journey, a lot of the birds bring excuses as to why they won’t go on the journey. So before the excitement kind of sets in, a lot of them kind of say, ‘oh, well I have a family, I have a business to deal with, I have this and that’ all the excuses that we human beings bring to not go on the journey the birds also bring. So that's also a very fun early section of the book that I encourage everyone to pay attention to. Just we don't have time for that. But the whole idea is that we all have different reasons not to go. But when we do go, we all have different experiences as well.

Leyla: Interesting. And just to put it in context, what about the other story of Attar that we did of the Conference of the Birds? Where does that fit into what we're reading right now?

Omid: Yeah, the Parable of the Moths shows up in the last vādee, in the last Valley as part of the experience of “fanā.” Because, as you remember, the different moths, they have different experiences of the journey, each one goes, one gets kind of a little bit close, the other one gets a little closer. But finally, it’s the last moth that goes so close to the flame that she basically burns up. That has the true experience of what the flame is like. Remember the pundit says, oh, that's the moth that truly knows what being close to the candle is like, because she has given herself over to the candle and experienced “fanā.” So that shows up as part of the illustration of what the idea of “fanā” is like in the story.

Leyla: So then this selection that you've gotten, so there are parts that we’re missing from that that you’ve taken out.

Omid: Absolutely, yes.

Leyla: But then does this span the entire work or is it just a selection from the beginning of it? Or where is it?

Omid: No, this is a selection from the beginning all the way to the end of the book. It’s just kind of an abridged version so that we can get an overview of the entire story and hopefully get excited about going and reading the actual details, each section and all the verses, which is 4,500.

Leyla: But we will have a spoiler.

Omid: There will be a spoiler, yes, that's a very good point. Towards the end there will be a spoiler. So people will have to decide on their own what they want to do with that, I suppose.

Leyla: Wonderful. Well, should we keep going on this section?

Omid: Yeah, let me read a couple more verses and then we can pause and do one last section. So here again, what's important is that the hoopoe is saying, look if you also go on this journey, but it's really Attar speaking to us, right? He's for the first time addressing us directly. And he’s saying “gar tō ham.” If you also go one day on this journey, you will also see what has happened. The word in verse 35 that I want to talk about is “aghabé”. “aghabé” literally refers to, like, a deep or a steep mountain path or like a difficult kind of climb. And so here, he uses it as a great obstacle, as a hardship. So he says, if you go on this route, on this journey and you experience and see one by one the hardships of this journey, only then you will see what it entails and what the work is and what the accomplishment is. So, in verse 36 that I just read, he also uses the expression “khoon khordan” once again and again, in Persian “khoon khordan” is an idiom for enduring pain and suffering. So, over and over, Attar is saying it's a difficult journey, but then it's also a very, very rewarding journey ultimately. And so we're going to come, soon enough to the reward of the journey, which is kind of the spoiler part, but I just want to kind of read this next verse before we break, just to set up the cliffhanger again, if we may, because, he says, “z'ān hamé morgh andakee ānjā raseed az hezārān kas yekee ānjā raseed” He says, ‘out of all those many, many birds,’ “ān hamé morgh” Only a few, “andakee ānja raseed,” arrived. Only a few out of those many, many birds. Only one per thousand, “az hezārān kas yekee”, Only one out of thousands. So out of each many thousands, only one. And so the number really starts to shrink along the way. And there's a whole section that Attar tells us how and why in each of these Valleys, some of the birds basically drop out of the journey, and they just kind of stop and they don't go all the way and that's also a really interesting section to read, because it speaks to the reasons we human beings end up not completing something that we undertake, especially this big journey of self-realization. Right? Many are inspired, but very few persevere. Which we also said is the case sometimes with our students. But so be it, we are all human. So maybe that's a good place to pause and then at the next session we'll get to the climax of the story.

Leyla: Wonderful, I love it. Thank you so much. Just to say that a little bit, we do talk about that often, about how learning is not a linear path. Learning anything is not a linear path either. And so there are a lot of setbacks, and it is, you know, in my experience with the students, it's been the ones that can just sit with the discomfort and the difficulty of learning something new, of having that discomfort of not knowing something and can persevere through that Valley, then come out on the other side. So I think that's really important.

Omid: Absolutely. We have lots of experiences in life like that where the excitement takes us forward, but then the discomfort that shows up along the way, the letting go of the familiar stops us from kind of, completing the journey. And then, because this is the ultimate journey, of course, it also falls under the same rules, right? That many take on this journey of ‘oh, let me figure out who I am, what truly rules me, what my principles of life should be and ought to be, what’s the truth of my existence?’ Which are really, really huge questions and really worthy of seeking. But then along the way, things happen that kind of discourage us or, for whatever reason, we just can't find that perseverance. But this is an encouragement to look for it and find it, for sure.

Leyla: Wonderful. All right. And that was part four. And we'll be back next time with the thrilling conclusion of this selection from Omid. Thank you so much, and until next time.

Omid: Thank you, Leyla jān!